In this discussion, Bly talks of four sources of shame, including shame inherited from parents, grandparents, and ancestors, and shame over our bodily and creative instincts. It opens with a Russian fairy story on the Frog Princess and the shame we feel over our interior "Frog Bride." Bly and host Michael Toms discuss the new work in America on shame, most of it done during the last ten years.

"As a man is, so he sees." These words of mystical poet and artist William Blake are just as relevant now as they were when they were written in 1802 - perhaps more so. Throughout his life, Blake undertook a voyage beyond rationality and materialism to an interior, visionary realm where "all things appear as they are - infinite." Yet all human beings, he believed, are capable of opening their eyes to a fuller experience of life.

Bly describes the three necessary and sequential life phases symbolized by three colors - the "red, white and black," in the Grimm Brothers' fairy tale "Iron John." He casts a penetrating light on these male life stages, describing complications that arise, for example, when a boy skips the red and goes directly to the white. He also discusses how these stages, when fulfilled, affect men's relationships with women.

Characterized by petty rivalries, self-indulgence and lack of responsibility, our actions fail to fulfill what Robert Bly describes as our true soul longing. With characteristic irreverence and storytelling from various cultures, Bly tells us what we should be doing about green-haired adolescents and idle elders, not to mention televisions and computers. His insightful focus illuminates the truths and possibilities of a culture caught in an adolescent phase of development.

An extraordinary visit with one of America's leading poets provides a unique exploration of the mystery of maleness. Bly uses fairy tales to illuminate the dark recesses of the psyche, and the result is a powerful intimation of the male experience and potential. From the soft, feminine male persona to the deeply buried wildman, Bly takes us on a journey through unmapped territory of the masculine. For men and women this is a conversation not to be missed.