Author and futurist James Wallman has spent decades making a simple but radical case: that we are moving from materialism to experientialism, toward a world where experiences, more than things, shape our culture, our economy, and our sense of what's possible.

In this episode of White Water, Maya sits down with James to talk about the slow, relentless work of building something you believe should exist—long before there's proof, polish, or consensus. From founding the World Experience Organization—the world's first global institution dedicated to the experience economy—to cultivating a truly international community of designers, strategists, and makers, James shares what it takes to turn conviction into infrastructure.

Together, Maya and James unpack the reality of community-building as a business practice: the patience it demands, the responsibility it carries, and the emotional endurance required to stay with an idea over time. They explore the experience economy not as a buzzword, but as a human-centered shift—one that asks leaders to think beyond transactions and toward transformation.

A bestselling author (Stuffocation, Time and How to Spend It), keynote speaker, and advisor to everyone from global brands to cultural institutions, James is both a thinker and a doer. His story is a masterclass in perseverance, belief, and the quiet courage it takes to build something simply because it should exist.

Listen in as Maya and James talk about White Water at scale—the uncertain, unglamorous middle where vision outruns the map, community is forged slowly, and meaningful change only happens if you're willing to keep going without guarantees.

Learn more about James and the WXO here: www.worldxo.org

____

White Water is a podcast about creative urgency and the magical things that happen when we 'ride the wave' of life.

Hosted by Maya Guice, business storyteller and Founder of Panakin Studios, each episode features candid stories of tenacity and grit from individuals leading creative ventures that span industries, mediums, and borders. If you've got an idea and don't know where to start, come hang out with us in the white water!

Panakin Studios is an interdisciplinary shop of thinkers and doers. Medium-agnostic, we're half think-tank, half content studio, creating a whole machine that produces new stories for smart audiences. www.panakin.co

"Authenticity" alone no longer earns trust; what matters for brands is ruthless self-awareness.

Originally published by Drucker+, the Drucker School of Management's thought leadership platform, this essay explores the rise of a new kind of audience — one that values depth, discernment, and creative integrity over noise.

In this special bonus episode, Maya reads her article aloud and unpacks how the "Discerning Class" is reshaping culture, business, and the creative economy.

Read the article on the Drucker Institute's website.

____

White Water is a podcast about creative urgency and the magical things that happen when we 'ride the wave' of life.

Hosted by Maya Guice, business storyteller and Founder of Panakin Studios, each episode features candid stories of tenacity and grit from individuals leading creative ventures that span industries, mediums, and borders. If you've got an idea and don't know where to start, come hang out with us in the white water!

Panakin Studios is an interdisciplinary shop of thinkers and doers. Medium-agnostic, we're half think-tank, half content studio, creating a whole machine that produces new stories for smart audiences. www.panakin.co

Painter Victoria Cassinova survived a five-story fall—and turned that life-altering moment into a masterclass in creative alchemy. From learning to walk again to redefining her path as an artist, Victoria shares how she transforms pain into purpose, and why manifesting your dreams often requires us to slow down to speed up.

Victoria is an LA-based visual artist whose work explores the unconscious and unseen. Her bold, multimedia style blends striking portraiture with abstract textures, touching on themes of identity, resilience, and community. Known for her large-scale public murals, her distinct voice has made her a sought-after collaborator for brands like Netflix, Disney Pixar, Adidas, CNN, Time Magazine, The Washington Post, Teen Vogue, and more. She's also contributed to political and social justice initiatives through powerful visual storytelling.

Entirely self-taught and fiercely expressive, Victoria's art is as much about social commentary as it is about beauty, placing her among the most compelling creative voices in LA's contemporary art scene.

Listen in as Maya and Victoria talk about what it means to be in the White Water——the messy, powerful process of turning change into creative growth.

Learn more about Victoria: www.vcassinova.com

____

White Water is a podcast about creative urgency and the magical things that happen when we 'ride the wave' of life.

Hosted by Maya Guice, business storyteller and Founder of Panakin Studios, each episode features candid stories of tenacity and grit from individuals leading creative ventures that span industries, mediums, and borders. If you've got an idea and don't know where to start, come hang out with us in the white water!

This episode was mixed, mastered, and music and sound designed by Dylan Agajanian.

Panakin Studios is an interdisciplinary shop of thinkers and doers. Medium-agnostic, we're half think-tank, half content studio, creating a whole machine that produces new stories for smart audiences. www.panakin.co