Bianca sits down with author Jonathan Edward Durham to talk about Winterset Hollow, his genre-bending novel that went from self-published hidden gem to cult favourite—and eventually landed a traditional publishing deal. Jonathan shares the unconventional journey behind the book, the power of word of mouth, and how he built an authentic social media following without constantly selling his work. They also dig into craft, from writing a book within a book to blending horror, fantasy, humour, and friendship—and why finding the right story can bring out your best writing.

Note: CeCe Lyra is a literary agent at Wendy Sherman Associates. If you’d like to query CeCe, please refer to the submission guidelines at www.wsherman.com. Carly Watters is a literary agent at P.S. Literary Agency, but her work on this podcast is not affiliated with the agency, and the views expressed by Carly on this podcast are solely that of her as a podcast co-host ​and do not necessarily reflect the views, opinions, policies, or position of P.S. Literary Agency.

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Websites: www.theshitaboutwriting.com, www.biancamarais.com, www.carlywatters.com and www.cecilialyra.com

Bookshop.org affiliate page: https://bookshop.org/shop/theshitnoonetellsyouaboutwriting

To sign up for our Substack newsletter, head to https://theshitaboutwriting.substack.com

Sign up for CeCe's course:

https://learn-with-cece.thinkific.com/products/courses/cecescoachingcorner

Will Carly have a serious case of FOMO after this Monday’s Shooting the Shit episode?! In this special episode, CeCe was supposed to fly solo—but instead, she twisted the arms of her former colleagues turned besties, literary agents Eric Smith, Nour Sallam, Adria Goetz, and Claire Harris, to join her for a publishing industry catch-up. This fireside chat amongst besties, covers everything from printing delays and a new children's imprint to the resurgence of bookstores and the latest buzz from the Frankfurt Book Fair. AI…the agents go there. Diving into the increasingly complicated world of AI in publishing, discussing author protections, AI-generated submissions, and the controversy surrounding AI detection tools like Pangram. This episode is packed with loads of laughs, strong opinions, and publishing industry hot takes. Sorry, Carly. You definitely missed a good one!

As mentioned on this episode:

Sign up for Coaching Corner for access to the editorial library with agents' feedback — including feedback from Eric, Claire, Adria, and Nour!

https://learn-with-cece.thinkific.com/products/courses/cecescoachingcorner

The first publisher to issue AI guidelines to authors and illustrators:

https://www.bloomsbury.com/us/connect/contact-us/ai-policy-for-authors-and-illustrators/

Supply Chain Issues Threaten Book Sales:

https://lunch.publishersmarketplace.com/2026/10/as-supply-chain-problems-increase-some-books-miss-on-sale-dates/

What's Hot at the Frankfurt Book Fair:

https://www.publishersweekly.com/pw/by-topic/industry-news/trade-shows-events/article/101287-frankfurt-book-fair-2026-what-s-hot-according-to-agents.html

Note: CeCe Lyra is a literary agent at Wendy Sherman Associates. If you’d like to query CeCe, please refer to the submission guidelines at www.wsherman.com. Carly Watters is a literary agent at P.S. Literary Agency, but her work on this podcast is not affiliated with the agency, and the views expressed by Carly on this podcast are solely that of her as a podcast co-host ​and do not necessarily reflect the views, opinions, policies, or position of P.S. Literary Agency.

Find us on our socials:

Threads: https://www.threads.net/@the_shit_about_writing

https://www.threads.net/@biancamarais_author

https://www.threads.net/@carlywatters https://www.threads.net/@cece_lyra_agent

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/the_shit_about_writing/

https://www.instagram.com/biancamarais_author/ https://www.instagram.com/carlywatters/ https://www.instagram.com/cece_lyra_agent/

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/TSNOTYAW

Websites: www.theshitaboutwriting.com, www.biancamarais.com, www.carlywatters.com and www.cecilialyra.com

Bookshop.org affiliate page: https://bookshop.org/shop/theshitnoonetellsyouaboutwriting

To sign up for our Substack newsletter, head to https://theshitaboutwriting.substack.com

It’s Books with Hooks week on the podcast! This week, CeCe and Bianca are joined by acquiring editor Elizabeth Hitti Musicant from Dial Press, an imprint of Penguin Random House. As they critique two queries, they break down choosing strong comps, creating specific stakes, trimming an overstuffed query, and making sure your opening pages deliver on your pitch. Plus, they unpack romantasy vs. romantic fantasy, prologues, dual POVs, and what it takes to create romantic chemistry readers can root for.

Note: CeCe Lyra is a literary agent at Wendy Sherman Associates. If you’d like to query CeCe, please refer to the submission guidelines at www.wsherman.com. Carly Watters is a literary agent at P.S. Literary Agency, but her work on this podcast is not affiliated with the agency, and the views expressed by Carly on this podcast are solely that of her as a podcast co-host ​and do not necessarily reflect the views, opinions, policies, or position of P.S. Literary Agency.

Find us on our socials:

Threads: https://www.threads.net/@the_shit_about_writing

https://www.threads.net/@biancamarais_author

https://www.threads.net/@carlywatters https://www.threads.net/@cece_lyra_agent

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/the_shit_about_writing/

https://www.instagram.com/biancamarais_author/ https://www.instagram.com/carlywatters/ https://www.instagram.com/cece_lyra_agent/

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/TSNOTYAW

Websites: www.theshitaboutwriting.com, www.biancamarais.com, www.carlywatters.com and www.cecilialyra.com

Bookshop.org affiliate page: https://bookshop.org/shop/theshitnoonetellsyouaboutwriting

To sign up for our Substack newsletter, head to https://theshitaboutwriting.substack.com