Dave Thomas is a programmer, author, publisher, and one of the original authors of the Agile Manifesto. He co-authored The Pragmatic Programmer with Andy Hunt and later co-founded the Pragmatic Bookshelf, applying software development practices to the way technical books are written, produced, tested, updated, and published.

In this episode, Dave talks about discovering programming as a teenager, writing The Pragmatic Programmer, bringing Ruby to an English-speaking audience, and helping create the Agile Manifesto. We also get into the origins of code kata, using AI without surrendering judgment to it, the decline of technical publishing, writing Simplicity, and what developers need to learn when generating code is easier than ever.

In this episode:

• How the Agile Manifesto came together and why Dave believes the movement lost its original focus
• Using feedback, iteration, and reversible decisions to change direction without losing everything
• Where code kata came from and what repetition teaches programmers
• Why using AI effectively still requires knowing how to do the work yourself
• How Dave discovered programming and found a way to express his ideas through code
• How consulting notes became The Pragmatic Programmer
• Why Dave and Andy Hunt decided to start the Pragmatic Bookshelf
• How software development practices shaped the way the Pragmatic Bookshelf produced books
• Writing Simplicity and working with an editor for the first time
• What AI and changing reading habits mean for technical publishing
• Why Dave measures professional success by the effect his work has had on other people
• The story behind his family's zombie apocalypse cellar

Topics: software development, programming, agile development, Agile Manifesto, artificial intelligence, code kata, technical writing, publishing, Pragmatic Bookshelf, The Pragmatic Programmer, Ruby

Roundabout: Creative Chaos is a podcast hosted by Tammy Coron exploring creativity, design, and technology. Listen at roundaboutcreativechaos.com and subscribe on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Venkat Subramaniam is a programmer, author, educator, and founder of Agile Developer. His career has taken him from computer architecture and software development to teaching, consulting, speaking, and writing books.

In this episode, Venkat talks about the unexpected decisions that changed the direction of his career, including volunteering to teach C before he really knew the language. We also get into how teaching changed the way he learns, what writing books taught him about feedback, and why he believes software development is as much about discipline as it is about technology.

In this episode:

• How Venkat found his way from engineering to software development
• Learning C by volunteering to teach it
• Why teaching became such an important part of his career
• Writing books and learning to value critical feedback
• What agile development means to Venkat and why adaptive planning matters
• How his thinking about AI has changed

Topics: software development, programming, agile development, teaching, technical writing, AI, software quality

Roundabout: Creative Chaos is a podcast hosted by Tammy Coron exploring creativity, design, and technology. Listen at roundaboutcreativechaos.com and subscribe on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Adam Tow has spent decades exploring what technology can do and building tools to solve problems he encounters along the way. A longtime Apple developer and technologist, he's created software ranging from early Newton applications to MixEffect, ActionPhrase, and his latest app, C1B.

C1B grew out of Adam's experience helping care for his father during cancer treatment. Faced with medications, appointments, schedules, notes, and information spread across multiple places, Adam built an app around the realities of day-to-day caregiving. His approach reflects a pattern that runs throughout his career: see a problem, understand it, and build something useful.

In this episode:

• Growing up with the Apple II and discovering software development
• Why Adam builds apps to solve problems he encounters himself
• Creating MixEffect and ActionPhrase
• How caregiving for his father led to C1B
• Using AI agents to develop software
• What AI could mean for the future of programming

In the after show: Adam shares another major chapter of his career: nearly 15 years with All Things D, Recode, and Vox Media, where he had a front-row seat to the changing technology industry.

Topics: Apple, software development, AI, caregiving, C1B, indie development

Roundabout: Creative Chaos is a podcast hosted by Tammy Coron exploring creativity, design, and technology. Listen at https://roundaboutcreativechaos.com and subscribe on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts.