In this moving conversation, Dr Tony Pisani speaks with Steve Wickham, a workplace health and safety professional, chaplain, and writer. Steve shares his remarkable journey from his early days as a tradesman in Western Australia, through personal trials of grief, loss, and recovery, to his current roles supporting first responders and families.

With honesty and warmth, Steve opens up about the people who shaped his path, the importance of kinship and purpose, and the lessons he has learned from decades of walking alongside others in crisis. His reflections highlight the power of presence, humility, and hope in the face of life’s deepest challenges.

Guest Bio:

Steve Wickham is a chaplain, pastor, and writer based in Western Australia. He began his career as a tradesman before moving into health and safety in 1997, working for decades as a safety professional. Today, he serves as a part-time chaplain with the Department of Fire and Emergency Services and Children and Families Pastor at a Baptist church.

Referenced Resources:

• The Entitlement Cure — Dr John Townsend
• Heartfelt (Australia) — photography and support for families experiencing stillbirth and infant loss
• EMDR (Eye Movement Desensitisation and Reprocessing)
• Department of Fire and Emergency Services (WA) — wellness and chaplaincy support

Production credits:
Hannah Corcoran, Producer and Senior Editor https://www.linkedin.com/in/h-corcoran/
Annie Lewis, Content Manager https://www.linkedin.com/in/annie-lewis-304854117/
Luke Pisani, Music https://www.instagram.com/lukepisani_/

(c) 2024. SafeSide Media, LLC.

In this special episode of Never the Same, we share the full keynote address from host, Professor Tony Pisani, delivered at the Suicide Prevention Australia Conference.

Professor Pisani explores how the structure of our relationships—not just how supported we feel—can protect people from suicide risk. Drawing on studies in schools, the military, and health settings, he shows how strong, shared connections make a difference, especially when people don’t or can’t speak up.

He introduces the Connect Program, a group-based training that strengthens team cohesion and reduces suicide risk without needing people to self-identify. The episode also includes real-world examples from Western Australia and beyond.

It explores not only the importance of social structure in prevention, but HOW we can build those networks.

Key Points Covered

• Why social structure matters in suicide prevention
• The power of shared trusted adults in reducing suicide risk
• How Connect builds protective networks
• Insights from high school and military research
• Shifting suicide reviews from blame to learning
• Local examples from Western Australia, including first responder initiatives and postvention pilots

🔗 Resources Mentioned

• SafeSide Prevention: https://safesideprevention.com.au
• Connect Program: WA Workplace Connect info page
• Never the Same podcast home: Podcast page

In this episode of "Never the Same," Tony Pisani sits down with two of Western Australia's leading mental health voices: Maureen Lewis, Mental Health Commissioner since 2023, and Dr. Nathan Gibson, Chief Psychiatrist since 2013. Together, they represent both the vision for reform and the clinical guardrails of accountability in Western Australia’s mental health system.

The conversation explores their unique roles in the mental health landscape, from commissioning services to regulatory oversight. They share insights on strategic leadership, including frameworks for crisis decision-making and the importance of "thinking time" in complex systems. The discussion covers First Nations mental health approaches, the integration of lived experience voices, and their shift toward trauma-informed care.

Both leaders reflect on their accidental paths to leadership, the challenges of managing a mental health system across one of the world's largest geographic health services, and what gives them hope for the future. Their candid discussion offers valuable lessons for anyone interested in systemic change and leadership in challenging environments.

Guests:

Maureen Lewis was appointed Mental Health Commissioner for Western Australia in July 2023. In this role, she oversees the commissioning of all mental health and drug and alcohol services in Western Australia, a role that combines purchasing decisions with advocacy.

Dr. Nathan Gibson has served as Western Australia's Chief Psychiatrist since 2013. He provides independent regulatory oversight under the Mental Health Act. His focus includes standards of care, quality, safety, and reducing restrictive practices across public and private psychiatric services.

Host Dr. Tony Pisani is a professor, clinician, and founder of SafeSide Prevention, leading its mission to build safer, more connected military, health, education, and workplace communities.

In this inspiring instalment of Never the Same, host Dr Tony Pisani welcomes Professor Pat Dudgeon, the first Aboriginal psychologist in Australia and a global voice for First Nations mental health.

Pat describes how confronting the racism in the system sparked her mission to “decolonise” psychology and build a new framework called Social and Emotional Wellbeing, a model that places self, family, community, culture, and Country at the centre of healing.

Across the episode, Pat and Tony revisit moments such as the Ways Forward national report, discuss why Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander suicide demands distinct responses, and celebrate community-led successes, from Indigenous Rangers caring for land to universities rewriting psychology curricula.

Key Points

• Pat’s path to becoming the first Aboriginal psychologist
• Origins and pillars of the SEWB paradigm
• The Ways Forward report and Boat Shed Declaration
• Distinct drivers of Aboriginal & Torres Strait Islander suicide
• Success stories: Indigenous Rangers, psychology curriculum reform
• The role of climate action and caring for Country

Resources Mentioned

• Ways Forward: National Aboriginal & Torres Strait Islander Mental Health Policy Report
• SEWB model diagram & “Working Together” chapter
• Dance of Life wellbeing model by Prof Helen Milroy
• Sweetgrass Research Method — Dr Mark Standing Eagle Baez
• Indigenous Rangers Program (Australia)

Professor Pat Dudgeon is a Bardi woman from the Kimberley and Australia’s first Aboriginal psychologist. She co-chairs the Centre of Best Practice in Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Suicide Prevention and advocates for culturally informed mental-health systems worldwide.

Dr. Tony Pisani is a professor, clinician, and founder of SafeSide Prevention, leading its mission to build safer, more connected military, health, education, and workplace communities.

Alan Woodward has spent decades strengthening crisis services around the world — from answering calls on the Lifeline crisis line to advising government leaders and building new programs. In this episode, Alan reflects on what it takes to face hard moments, how crisis services save lives, and why kindness (to others and ourselves) matters more than we realise.

Together, we explore the lessons Alan learned growing up in a coastal city in Australia, navigating career changes, managing anxiety, and staying committed to making the world better.

Guest:
Alan Woodward is a global leader in crisis support and suicide prevention. His work spans decades of service as a researcher, advocate, and advisor to governments and organisations, with deep roots in community-based care.

Host:
Dr. Tony Pisani is a professor, clinician, and founder of SafeSide Prevention, leading its mission to build safer, more connected military, health, education, and workplace communities.

Resources and References Mentioned:

• Madelyn Gould, Columbia University – suicide prevention research.
• Consensus Statement on Crisis Support from international crisis line networks
• International Association for Suicide Prevention – work on decriminalisation of suicide
• Lifeline International – Alan’s current organisation
• Ghana's Decriminalisation of Suicide – paper
• Australia’s National Suicide Prevention Strategy – released this year
• Professor Rory O’Connor – theory of suicide and the role of entrapment
• Royal Commission into Robodebt (Australia) – Submission from Suicide Prevention Australia

Nicole Doyley’s life and writing centre on one key question: What about the children?

In this episode, Nicole reflects on growing up in a biracial family, her evolving racial identity, and the parenting values she developed as a result. She discusses transracial adoption, the impact of Black History Month, how culture shapes resilience, and why awareness and humility are essential for any caregiver.

Nicole shares her family’s story, from her parents’ marriage in the 1960s (when their marriage was still illegal in some states) to her own cross-cultural marriage to a Jamaican man, and how these experiences shaped her understanding of race, belonging, and what it means to be “seen.”

Guest: Nicole Doyley is an author and podcast host whose latest book, What About the Children? Five Values for Multiracial Families draws from her personal and professional experiences. Nicole grew up in a biracial family, served as a campus pastor, and now helps parents and communities navigate race, identity, and parenting with honesty and cultural awareness.

Host: Dr. Tony Pisani is a professor, clinician, and founder of SafeSide Prevention, leading its mission to build safer, more connected military, health, education, and workplace communities.

Resources and References:

• Nicole Doyley – What About the Children? Five Values for Multiracial Families
• Chimamanda Ngozi Adichie – The Danger of a Single Story
• The Mis-Education of the Negro by Carter G. Woodson
• Lecrae – story of racial identity, healing, and therapy
• U.S. Census – changes to allow multiple racial identities (2000)
• Nicole's podcast – First a Man: growing up in a Black nation (featuring her husband Marvin)

In this episode, Nieves Murray, CEO of Suicide Prevention Australia, joins Dr. Tony Pisani for an insightful conversation about leadership, equity, and personal transformation. From her early career in engineering to leading national suicide prevention strategy, Nieves brings a rich mix of personal stories, professional insights, and hard-earned wisdom.

Key Themes

• The power of bilingual and bicultural identity
• Leadership lessons from aged care, finance, and suicide prevention
• Changing minds: how experience reshapes perspective
• Balancing data with lived experience in policy work
• Grief, care, and learning from family

Nieves Murray: Nieves Murray is the CEO of Suicide Prevention Australia and has spent over 35 years in leadership roles across aged care, finance, and human services. Recognised as one of Australia’s 100 Most Influential Women, she is a champion of systems thinking, community voice, and inclusive policy.

Dr. Tony Pisani: Dr. Tony Pisani is a professor, clinician, and founder of SafeSide Prevention, leading its mission to build safer, more connected military, health, education, and workplace communities.

Resources and References

• National Policy Platform by Suicide Prevention Australia
• Good to Great: Why Some Companies Make The Leap and Others Don't by Jim Collins

Welcome to the Never the Same Podcast! Today, we dive into the science of suicide prevention with Jacinta Hawgood, a clinical psychologist, senior lecturer, and researcher at Griffith University.

Host Tony Pisani is joined by Jacinta, a leader in the field with nearly 25 years of experience, to discuss how structured approaches like the STARS Protocol are reshaping conversations about suicide. Together, they explore:

• How STARS (Systematic Tailored Assessment for Responding to Suicidality) bridges structured tools and personal stories.
• Why protective factors and client-driven care are essential for meaningful interventions.
• How suicide prevention is evolving, with new roles for non-clinical professionals and lived experience leaders.
• The biggest misconceptions about suicide, including fears around asking direct questions.

Jacinta also reflects on her career, how her thinking has changed over time, and why listening deeply is at the heart of effective care.

Don't forget to like & subscribe so you never miss an episode! Together, we’re exploring the stories and strategies that can make a difference.

(c) 2024. SafeSide Media, LLC.