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What if machines could learn the world the way humans do?

Not by crunching data and predicting tokens, but by understanding the world and how it works?

Imagine a robot that doesn’t just see a chair, but understands it— its purpose, its relationship to the table, the way you might pull it closer before sitting down.

That’s the world Matt Miesnieks is building.

Matt is the CEO of Primate.AI, a new kind of physical AI company rethinking how machines perceive and interact with reality. His team is exploring what happens when perception stops being a math problem and starts becoming an act of intuition.

Before founding Primate, Matt helped shape the modern era of spatial computing. He co-founded 6D.AI, the company that pioneered the AR Cloud—a real-time 3D map of the world that made digital content persistent in physical space. 6D.AI was later acquired by Niantic, creators of Pokémon Go, where its technology now powers their next generation of AR experiences.

Now, with Primate.AI, Matt’s taking his biggest swing yet: building machines that perceive reality the way we do—not through pixels, but through concepts, memory, and innate understanding.

If 6D.AI gave AR its eyes, Primate.AI is giving machines a mind.

In this conversation, we explore the future of embodied intelligence, what comes after language models, and why understanding the world like a human may be the only real path to AGI.

Today’s guests are building one of the most ambitious startups in the entire spatial computing industry.

The company is called RP1, and we’re sitting down with co-founders Sean Mann and Dean Abramson.

On its face, RP1 is the world’s first true metaverse browser, trying to do for spatial computing what browsers like Mosaic and Internet Explorer did for the web.

But that’s just the tip of the iceberg.

Beneath the surface, RP1 is so much more... They’re building all the infrastructure and protocols required for a truly spatial internet—one where immersive, persistent digital worlds stream on demand, where physical and virtual environments seamlessly merge, and where millions of users can interact in one, shared world, not a bunch of silo’d virtual experiences.

In this episode, we dive into what RP1 actually is, how it scales to millions of users, and why they believe app stores must die.

We also unpack their vision for the core backbone of this future, a Spatial Fabric—a kind of real-time, distributed protocol for the metaverse that manages everything from identity and maps to avatars and live services.

This one’s technical, philosophical, and wildly ambitious. Let’s get into it.

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This interview is with Alvin Graylin — one of the boldest voices out there today on AI, reimagining civilization in the age of intelligence.

Alvin is the best-selling author of the book, Our Next Reality, which is a super thought provoking exploration of how immersive tech and artificial intelligence are going to reshape every layer of society.

Prior, Alvin spent over a decade on the front lines of the XR industry—building and leading HTC’s VR business in China, and serving as Chairman of the Virtual World Society.

Today, Alvin's on a new mission: to help humanity navigate the AI transition—researching, writing, and evangelizing ways to ensure AI serves a greater good and unlocks an age of abundance.

And While Alvin is an optimist, he’s also a realist—and he’s clear that this transition won’t be smooth unless we get a few critical things right.

We talk about…

* The real risks of AGI—not just killer robots, but unaligned incentives, unchecked power, and job displacement.

* His call for an “AI Bill of Rights,” and why the U.S. and China must shift from competition to cooperation—perhaps through what he calls a CERN for AI. (worth checking out the link to AI Bill of Rights here)

* And finally, we explore XR—not as a form of escape, but as a tool for empathy, education, and rewiring human behavior at scale.

This conversation is expansive, urgent, and radical. Let’s get into it. Enjoy.