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The CTO Podcast

The CTO Podcast

Von: Insights & Strategies for Chief Technology Officers Navigating the C-Suite while Balancing Technical Strategy Team Management & Innovation
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 The CTO Podcast explores the worlds of Chief Technical officers as they manage the trials, tribulations, and triumphs of technologists in the C-suite. Hosted by Etienne de Bruin, founder of 7CTOs and author of CTO Excellence in 100 Days: Becoming the leader your company deserves.

www.ctopod.comEtienne De Bruin Erfolg im Beruf Ökonomie
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  • The Software Factory: Why Document-Driven Development Is Reshaping How CTOs Build

    The Software Factory: Why Document-Driven Development Is Reshaping How CTOs Build
    Dec 19 2025
    “We’re not doing software development anymore. We’re engineering a factory.”That single line from Matt Ferguson captures a fundamental shift happening in technology leadership. As CTO of Roof Maxx—a nationwide roofing brand with 385 dealerships—Ferguson has spent the past year transforming how his team builds software. The methodology he’s championing isn’t new, but its implications in the age of AI are profound.It’s called Document-Driven Development. And if you’re still measuring your engineering team by lines of code, you may be optimizing for the wrong century.The Cost of Software Is CollapsingFerguson opens with a provocative claim: “The cost of software goes to zero.”He’s quick to acknowledge this is a euphemism—a deliberate exaggeration meant to spark conversation. But the directional truth is harder to dispute. When a team that once needed 100 engineers can now accomplish the same work with 10, or when the same team can produce 10x the output, the economics of software fundamentally change.“If they’re not taking into consideration the risk of their business when the cost of software goes to zero,” Ferguson says of potential vendor partners, “then they’re not gonna be a partner in two years because they’re gonna be out of business.”The data on AI-assisted coding tells a more nuanced story. A recent randomized controlled trial from METR found that experienced developers were actually 19% slower when using AI tools—despite believing they were 20% faster. Meanwhile, studies from GitHub and Microsoft show gains of 20-55%, with the strongest improvements among junior developers tackling well-defined tasks.The takeaway isn’t that AI doesn’t help. It’s that how you use it matters enormously. And that’s where Document-Driven Development enters the picture.What Is Document-Driven Development?At its core, Document-Driven Development flips the traditional software process. Instead of diving into code and documenting later (or never), teams invest heavily upfront in requirements, specifications, and architectural documentation—then use AI to generate code from those artifacts.“Our document-driven development is the concept of writing down what you want to do, what your problem is that you want to solve, in a descriptive enough way that the AI can interpret and plan the work, and through that plan can execute the code,” Ferguson explains.The approach has been championed by Ryan Vice, CEO of Vice Software, through his DocDD.ai methodology. GitHub recently validated the concept with their “Spec-Driven Development” toolkit, and AWS published their “AI-Driven Development Lifecycle” framework—both emphasizing documentation as the critical input to AI-assisted coding.Ferguson’s team has taken this further than most. His developers now spend roughly 90% of their time writing and refining requirements, and only 10% reviewing code.“Documents are your new code,” he says. “Treat them like code, put them in your GitHub repository as code, and iterate on them as your source code.”The Goal: One-Shot Code GenerationThe ambition behind Document-Driven Development is what Ferguson calls “one-shotting” the code—generating production-ready software on the first attempt.“We’re not here to pull the old slot machine and see what we get,” he explains. “Oh, all jacks. That’s wonderful. Oh, we didn’t win that one. Try again. Until AI gives us the right answer. That’s not what we’re after.”This stands in stark contrast to “vibe coding”—the practice of giving AI a rough prompt and iteratively debugging whatever emerges. Ferguson sees this as a recipe for unreproducible results and mounting technical debt.“If you’re not putting time into governance and you’re giving everybody free reign to do whatever they want,” he warns, “you’re gonna get different results. And when you try to build that piece of software six months from now, you might get a different result—which is not acceptable.”The key insight is that the “one shot” doesn’t mean one interaction with AI. It means extensive iteration on the documents—using AI to stress-test requirements, identify edge cases, and refine specifications—before any code is written.“We probably did a lot of interactions with AI, conversations with a highly intelligent, highly well-reasoning system,” Ferguson clarifies. “Just so that we’re getting to that point where we think a one shot is possible.”Systems Thinking: The Intellectual FoundationUnderneath Ferguson’s methodology lies a deeper framework: systems thinking, particularly as articulated by Donella Meadows in her seminal work “Thinking in Systems: A Primer.”Meadows identified 12 leverage points for intervening in complex systems, ranked from least to most powerful. At the bottom are parameters and numbers—the metrics most organizations obsess over. At the top are paradigm shifts—fundamental ...
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    1 Std. und 3 Min.
  • LIQUID – How CTOs Harness Complexity to Unlock Flow

    LIQUID – How CTOs Harness Complexity to Unlock Flow
    Aug 20 2025
    In this conversation, Nishant interviews Kathy Keating, Etienne de Bruin, and Scott Graves, co-authors of LIQUID: How CEOs and CTOs Unlock Flow and Momentum in Complex Systems. They discuss how the idea for the book was born, the challenges of co-authoring as three CTOs, and how they shaped the narrative through the fictional characters Alice (CEO) and Theo (CTO). The authors share how their distinct voices and strengths fused together: Scott’s deep knowledge of complex adaptive systems, Kathy’s operational lens, and Etienne’s ability to simplify and communicate concepts. Together, they created a framework that blends philosophy, practice, and story.The conversation highlights the importance of seeing organizations as complex adaptive systems and the risks of companies becoming either “boiling” (chaotic) or “frozen” (rigid). The authors emphasize that true leadership comes from navigating toward liquidity, the state where flow and adaptability are preserved. They reflect on the critical role of CEO-CTO partnership, the necessity of boundaries, and the difficulty of shifting culture once it stagnates. They also explore why the timing of LIQUID is especially relevant today. As technology accelerates, craft alone is not enough. Leaders must become sense-makers and problem-solvers at the systems level.About the BookLIQUID takes readers inside the hidden systems that drive every organization. Using the fictional journey of Alice, a founder-CEO, and Theo, her engineer-turned-CTO, the book shows how teams often slide into boiling chaos or frozen rigidity without realizing it. By illustrating the patterns of complexity through story, the authors make abstract concepts tangible and immediately useful.At its core, LIQUID argues that the most important role of the CTO is not simply delivering technology but stewarding the entire system so that people and processes remain in flow. The book introduces accessible frameworks, practical language, and vivid scenarios that help leaders spot when their organizations are shifting out of balance and how to guide them back to a liquid state.Whether you are a CEO, CTO, or executive navigating rapid change, LIQUID is a blueprint for unlocking resilience, adaptability, and momentum in your company. It bridges systems thinking with real-world leadership and equips you to see and influence the invisible dynamics that make or break technology organizations.Time Stamps00:00: Introduction: Why LIQUID matters now02:00: Behind the authors: creativity, systems, and personal lenses07:00: Discovering each other’s strengths during the writing process13:00: Pivoting the book: from frameworks to storytelling17:00: The origin story: from CTO failures to systemic insights23:00: Defining the role of the CTO in complex systems28:00: Why now: AI, accelerated change, and systems thinking33:00: The 7CTOs connection and levels of complexity40:00: Why Alice and Theo: storytelling as a teaching tool46:00: Subjective perspectives in complex systems52:00: The hidden world of complexity and CTO boundaries59:00: CEOs and CTOs as co-sensemakers1:04:00: Simple versus complex language in leadership communication1:12:00: Culture as the hardest complexity to shift1:20:00: Coaching example: boiling versus frozen organizations1:28:00: The CEO’s challenge: orchestrating boundaries1:31:00: Partnership, empathy, and trust at the executive level1:33:00: If LIQUID had a soundtrackLIQUID: LinkedIn / WebsiteContact Nishant: LinkedInContact Etienne: Website / YouTube / LinkedIn / X / Instagram / The CTO Podcast WebsiteContact Kathy: Website /LinkedInContact Scott: Website / LinkedIn This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit www.ctopod.com
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    1 Std. und 35 Min.
  • Steven Zgaljic, Jahnel Group, CTO: Harnessing AI for Health Insights

    Steven Zgaljic, Jahnel Group, CTO: Harnessing AI for Health Insights
    Apr 1 2025

    RSVP to the 13th CTO Colloquium on 4/17/25

    In this episode, Steven Zgaljic, CTO of Jahnel Group, joins host Etienne de Bruin to share a personal story about his daughter’s health challenges. Faced with the need to meticulously track symptoms and daily activities, Steven leveraged his technical expertise to create a custom AI-powered solution using tools like N8N and Superbase. The conversation highlights how AI can transform complex problems into actionable insights, even in personal contexts.

    Steven discusses the challenges of using traditional methods like pen and paper for symptom tracking, leading him to build an automated workflow integrated with Slack. By applying AI for data validation and pattern recognition, he gains real-time insights into potential triggers and patterns in his daughter's symptoms. Beyond his personal use case, Steven reflects on the broader applications of AI in problem-solving and the necessity of human oversight in AI-driven systems.

    This conversation explores the intersection of personal challenges, technological innovation, and the potential of AI to improve lives.

    Timestamps

    00:00 Introduction and Overview 01:00 Steven Zgaljic's Background and Family Story 03:00 Challenges with Tracking Medical Symptoms for His Daughter 05:00 Using Slack for Family Communication 07:00 Applying AI to Track and Analyze Symptoms 09:00 Exploring N8N, Superbase, and AI for Automation 11:00 Creating Validation Models for AI Accuracy 13:00 Building a Custom AI System for Health Tracking 15:00 AI Insights and Pattern Recognition in Health Data 17:00 Future Plans for AI Health Analysis 18:00 Reflections on AI in Problem Solving

    We have 200+ CTOs in peer groups: Quick Testimonials Video

    Contact Etienne: Website / YouTube / LinkedIn / X / Instagram / The CTO Podcast WebsiteContact Steven: Website /LinkedIn

    Great news! The CTO Podcast has been featured on Feedspot's list of Top CTO Podcasts. Huge thanks to our amazing guests and listeners for being part of these conversations. Check out the full list here: Feedspot’s Top CTO Podcasts.



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    19 Min.
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