https://page2pod.com - Your primary Google Business Profile category is the most powerful local ranking signal you control, and most businesses pick the wrong one.

Greg Gifford, Chief Strategy Officer at SearchLab, joins Jon Clark and Joe DeVita to separate what's actually changing in local search from the noise. His position: SEO isn't being replaced, but the foundations now feed a second consumer. AI models pull from the same local directories, reviews, and off-site brand signals that local SEO has always depended on — Yext research found 86% of AI citations for local businesses come from local SEO directory sites — which makes accuracy and off-site presence more valuable, not less.

Greg also gets into why SearchLab reorganized its SEO team around specialists instead of generalists, why customer service became a retention lever, and why AI search is probabilistic rather than deterministic — so the recommendation matters more than the citation link everyone's tracking.

Plus a lot of automotive: OEM content pushdowns, the approved vendor program, and why dealerships consistently misunderstand service and parts search.

📍 In This Episode

- Why SearchLab moved from SEO generalists to specialist teams — and how they ran the re-org without losing people

- Is your primary Google Business Profile category costing you map pack visibility?

- Why dealerships lose service and parts searches to Jiffy Lube

- Separate department profiles for parts and service, and the eligibility rule Google waived for car dealers

- When do city and location pages cross the line into doorway page spam?

- Review gating, the FTC update, and why Google is removing reviews 400 at a time

- Recovering filtered Yelp reviews — a 15–20% return without earning a single new review

- Local citations as the ante, not the win: what directories actually do for AI search visibility

- Digital PR as off-site brand building, not link building with a new name

A practical look at where local SEO fundamentals still hold, where they've quietly changed, and what AI search is rewarding right now.

Subscribe for new episodes with the practitioners actually doing this work.

Comment below: what's your primary Google Business Profile category, and when was the last time you actually questioned it?

Connect with Greg Gifford

✅ SearchLab Digital → https://searchlabdigital.com

✅ Greg on LinkedIn → https://www.linkedin.com/in/greggifford/

✅ Greg on Reddit → https://www.reddit.com/user/BAMFOC

✅ Greg on X: https://twitter.com/greggifford

✅ Greg on Bluesky: ​​https://bsky.app/profile/greggifford.bsky.social

✅ Greg on Slidesshare: https://www.slideshare.net/greggifford?itemsPerPage=16

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Sponsored by Moving Traffic Media → https://www.movingtrafficmedia.com

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Follow Jon Clark

✅ Jon Clark on Twitter → https://x.com/jonlclark

✅ Jon Clark on Linkedin → https://www.linkedin.com/in/jonlclark

🛠️ Tools & Resources Mentioned

- Culture Index (hiring/personality pattern tool) → https://www.cultureindex.com

- Culture Index (hiring/personality pattern tool) → https://www.cultureindex.com

- Google Business Profile + the GBP Community Forum → https://support.google.com/business/community?hl=en

- Local Search Tuesday → https://searchlabdigital.com/local-search-tuesdays/

- G50 Summit (SEO Oktoberfest) → https://seoktoberfest.net/

- SEO Week Presentation → https://seoweek.org/greg-gifford/

https://page2pod.com - Why social and video now decide whether your brand makes it into AI Overviews — and why your own website is the last place to optimize.

Cindy Krum, founder and CEO of MobileMoxie, argues that video has moved from a digital marketing must to an SEO must. Her case: LLMs are consensus machines. They don't care that your site says you're the best at something — they're aggregating what social, reviews, publishers, creators, and video say about you. If the web can't agree on what your brand is for, you haven't done the work.

She also walks through why a long-form video with real chapters behaves like a set of separate blog posts, each section eligible to answer a different question, and why short-form vertical video still matters for discovery even though it isn't showing up in AI Overviews yet. Plus: entity-first indexing, query fan-out, People Also Ask as the testing ground for AI Overview inclusion, and where Google Discover, Merchant Center, and TikTok Shop collide.

🎥 In This Episode

- Why Google keeps pulling YouTube into AI Overviews

- Do engagement metrics matter for getting cited by AI?

- Scripting video so the transcript contains the actual search phrase

- Turning your help center and FAQ pages into video answers

- Where vertical video ranks today — and where it doesn't

- What should a video chapter structure actually look like?

- Entity-first indexing, MUM, and query fan-out, explained plainly

- Building an entity plus its modifiers into an AEO prompt set

- Who owns SEO when discovery happens on social and Reddit

If search has become a journey that moves across platforms, this is a practical map of where to spend your effort first.

Subscribe for weekly conversations with the practitioners shaping SEO, AEO, and GEO.

Drop a comment: at your company, who actually owns social video — the SEO team or the social team? And has that changed in the last year?

Find Cindy Krum

✅ MobileMoxie → https://mobilemoxie.com

✅ Cindy on X → https://x.com/suzzicks

✅ Cindy on LinkedIn → https://www.linkedin.com/in/cindykrum

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Sponsored by Moving Traffic Media → https://www.movingtrafficmedia.com

Follow the Page 2 Podcast

✅ Page 2 Podcast on Youtube → https://www.youtube.com/@thepage2podcast922

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✅ Page 2 Podcast on Facebook → https://www.facebook.com/ThePage2Podcast/

✅ Page 2 Podcast on Instagram → https://www.instagram.com/page2pod

✅ Page 2 Podcast on Tiktok → https://www.tiktok.com/@jonleeclark

Follow Jon Clark

✅ Jon Clark Official Site → https://jonclark.co

✅ Jon Clark on Twitter → https://x.com/jonlclark

✅ Jon Clark on Linkedin → https://www.linkedin.com/in/jonlclark

Chapters

0:00 Search Beyond the Website

2:16 Cindy Krum and MobileMoxie

5:51 Why Google Cares About Video

8:49 How Social Drives Brand-First Search

11:47 Scripting Video for Keywords

13:56 Turning Support Content Into Video

15:42 Vertical Video and AI Overviews

17:40 How Should You Structure Chapters?

20:12 Sponsor: Moving Traffic Media

20:56 AEO as a Branding Channel

24:15 Journeys, Micro-Moments, and MUM

26:53 Entity-First Indexing Explained

31:44 People Also Ask as Query Fan-Out

33:53 Merchant Center, Discover, TikTok Shop

38:45 Where to Focus for AI Overviews

40:02 Who Owns SEO Now?

44:14 Rapid Fire and Career Advice

🛠️ Tools & Resources Mentioned

- OtterlyAI (Thomas Peham, previous episode) → https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hJsQ2qJho-M

- All About Fraggles → https://moz.com/blog/fraggles

- Google MUM (Multitask Unified Model) → https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DQDRL8MwVj0

- See Cindy at the Amaze Conference → https://amazeconference.com/

https://page2pod.com - Publishers with OpenAI deals get cited 48% more by ChatGPT. Thomas Peham of Otterly.AI on what AI search citation testing actually shows.

Most AI search advice is theory. Thomas Peham, CEO and co-founder of Otterly.AI, runs a team with two full-time GEO researchers whose only job is to test it. Across millions of citations from ChatGPT, Claude, Gemini, and Google AI Overviews, a consistent picture emerges: corporate and brand websites supply roughly 40–60% of all citations, niche and trade media outperformed mainstream publishers in 16 of 17 US industries studied, and publishers holding licensing deals with OpenAI pick up about 48% more ChatGPT citations than those without.

The uncomfortable findings are here too. Schema markup lifted Google organic and AI Overviews visibility but did nothing measurable on ChatGPT. Crawl data shows almost no activity on llms.txt files, while sitemaps get hit constantly. A fictional agency with no clients and no history got recommended by ChatGPT purely by earning mentions in the articles ChatGPT was already citing. And 25% of the URLs ChatGPT cites are dead links.

Thomas also shares Otterly.AI's own Claude numbers, which should make anyone in B2B re-examine their analytics: Claude accounts for 0.1–0.2% of their website traffic, but 10.6% of net-new leads name it as where they first heard about the company.

🧪 In This Episode

- Why hiring dedicated GEO researchers became the marketing strategy

- Does schema markup actually influence ChatGPT citations?

- The llms.txt crawl data — and why sitemaps deserve the attention instead

- Where AI citations come from: corporate sites, niche media, and publisher licensing deals

- The fake London SEO agency experiment and what it exposes about off-page manipulation

- Building brand sentiment through reviews, product content, and a central brand entity

- Why YouTube long-form gets cited regardless of view count

- What Claude's citation data reveals about B2B buying you can't see in analytics

A practitioner's look at what's been tested, what held up, and what marketers should stop doing.

Subscribe for new episodes with the people actually running the experiments in SEO, AEO, and GEO.

Which finding would change your roadmap first — the schema results, the llms.txt crawl data, or the 48% licensing gap? Tell us in the comments.

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Sponsored by Moving Traffic Media → https://www.movingtrafficmedia.com

Follow the Page 2 Podcast

✅ Page 2 Podcast on Youtube → https://www.youtube.com/@thepage2podcast922

✅ Page 2 Podcast on Linkedin → https://www.linkedin.com/company/page2podcast

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✅ Page 2 Podcast on Instagram → https://www.instagram.com/page2pod

✅ Page 2 Podcast on Tiktok → https://www.tiktok.com/@jonleeclark

Follow Jon Clark

✅ Jon Clark on Twitter → https://x.com/jonlclark

✅ Jon Clark on Linkedin → https://www.linkedin.com/in/jonlclark

🛠️ Tools & Resources Mentioned

- Thomas Peham → https://thomas-peham.com/

- Thomas Peham on LinkedIn → https://www.linkedin.com/in/thomaspeham/

- Thomas Peham on Twitter → https://twitter.com/tompeham

- Thomas Peham on Instagram → https://www.instagram.com/tompeham/- Otterly.AI → https://otterly.ai - Otterly.AI's Agent Analytics → https://otterly.ai/blog/agent-analytics/ - Otterly.AI's Claude Citation Study: https://www.linkedin.com/posts/thomaspeham_our-claude-citation-study-shows-reddit-activity-7477977546194849792-gu8-/