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The Club of Rome Podcast

The Club of Rome Podcast

Van: The Club of Rome
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Thought leaders and changemakers explore the mindshifts and policy solutions needed to transform the complex challenges facing humanity and the planet today.Copyright 2022 All rights reserved. Politik & Regierungen Wissenschaft
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  • Understanding a multipolar world with Chandran Nair

    Understanding a multipolar world with Chandran Nair
    25 Sep 2026
    Is the shifting global order heading towards conflict, or can the world's many civilisations and worldviews learn to coexist? In this episode, Chandran Nair, founder and CEO of the Global Institute for Tomorrow and member of the Club of Rome, joins Nolita Mvunelo to unpack the tensions reshaping international relations. Nair argues that today's flashpoints, from Ukraine to Gaza to Venezuela, stem from the West's difficulty in accepting the rise of other powers, and he challenges us to rethink what leadership, democracy and accountability mean in a crowded, unequal world. Tune in for a candid, provocative discussion on power, history and the search for a genuinely multipolar peace. Transcript Nolita: It is perhaps clearer than ever that the global geopolitical order is shifting. The question is, will this happen through force and disruption, or can we transition to a world where many civilisations and worldviews can coexist in mutual respect? Today's guest is well-placed to explore these answers. Chandran Nair is founder and CEO of the Global Institute for Tomorrow, a Pan-Asian think tank based in Hong Kong, focused on advancing a deeper understanding of global issues, including the shift of economic and political influence from the West to Asia, and the reshaping of the rules of global capitalism. His books include "Understanding China," "Dismantling Global White Privilege" and "Consumptionomics: Asia's Role in Reshaping Capitalism and Saving the Planet." In our conversation, we discuss how different worldviews are influencing the global landscape today and possible pathways to a more peaceful multipolar world. Chandran, thank you so much for joining us today. I'm going to jump straight into the first question. So last year, in 2025, you released a book on Understanding China, which is a report to the Club of Rome and you reinforced the idea of multiple worldviews. You speak about how the Chinese see an all-encompassing civilisational concept called Under the Heaven. From this vantage point, how do you see the current relationship between existing civilisations and worldviews and what is standing in the way of reconciling those worldviews? Chandran: What I mentioned in the book was simply to try and get people to understand that China and other large countries see the world quite differently in terms of its complexities and the relationship between countries than the West. And if you're an objective observer of history and of Chinese, uh, China's relationship with the world, you'll see that by far, the Chinese have adhered to that to that sort of principle of coexistence, civilizational relationships, et cetera. That is not to say that some may interpret some actions of China, as some are doing, as a departure from that. But broadly, if you're an objective observer, you will say the same. You would probably see the same of India as well. I'd just like to make a point about this term civilisation. Everybody uses that. I sort of don't like it because it seems to imply that there are hundreds of civilisations around and depends how you wanna define a civilisation. There's a lot of arguments of what is a civilisation. And then we can get into a rabbit hole of civilisations, right? And then this whole thing about, "well, which civilisation is older? Which civilisation is deeper? Which civilisation has absorbed all of these things?" And all of that. So I sort of don't like that civilisational term, though in the context of trying to explain China to the world, I do say that China remains very much a civilisational state. You could not say that the United States is a civilisational state. Question it has... Nolita: What's the... Chandran: Well, because it's too young. It has no underlying sort of long history of 10,000 years of a culture, civilisation, traditions, et cetera, born. So it's from all of the place. If the Native Americans had not been slaughtered, then you'd say there was a civilisation there. So that's a point I would like to make. I think your second question was how do I see the current world order in terms of civilisational relationships. Am I correct? Nolita: Yeah and worldviews. 'Cause, I mean, you mentioned that you wouldn't consider, necessarily, the US a civilisational state because of its age, but it also represents a very specific type of worldview versus the under the heaven worldview you were describing in the book. How do these, you know, interact and what does reconciling them look like? Chandran: Yeah. I mean, the American worldview you could call it's a punk view, because it's the new punk in town who became very rich and through, as we know colonisation, I would say, I think it would be fairly said genocide, extermination of large amounts of flora and fauna particularly. But this is basically a modern warring state. Advanced technologically, but doesn't make it a civilisation. So let's cut to the chase. What we're saying actually is today's tensions in...
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    31 min.
  • Africa's AI crossroads with Yemi Keri

    Africa's AI crossroads with Yemi Keri
    28 Aug 2026
    While the world debates artificial intelligence's implications for economies and everyday life, one question is too often overlooked: what does the AI revolution mean for Africa? In this episode, Till Kellerhoff, director for content and programmes at the Club of Rome, speaks with Yemi Keri, a technology executive, impact investor and ecosystem builder and member of the Club of Rome with over two decades of leadership experience across Africa's public and private sectors. As co-founder of Rising Tide Africa and president of the African Business Angel Network, Yemi brings a distinctive lens on inclusive capital and early-stage innovation. She sets out an optimistic case for AI as a "development equaliser" that could transform agriculture, healthcare and education across the continent, while pressing for African data sovereignty, homegrown cloud infrastructure and greater investment in local talent. The conversation also turns to the risks of a new extractive era built on data rather than raw materials, the energy demands of AI infrastructure, and why more women need a seat at the table in building the technology's future. Is this Africa's chance to leapfrog towards a more ethical and sustainable AI revolution, or do we risk repeating old patterns of inequality in new forms? Transcript Till: While everyone currently talks about artificial intelligence and its implications for our work, our economies and our lives, one topic that is often underexplored is the implications of the AI revolution for African countries and Africa's digital transformation. And one of the tech leaders driving this transformation is Yemi Keri. Yemi is a technology executive, impact investor and ecosystem builder with over two decades of leadership experience across the public and private sectors in Africa. She's the co-founder of Rising Tide Africa, a women-focused angel investment network and the president of the African Business Angel Network, where she champions inclusive capital and supports the growth of early-stage ventures across the continent. I'm Till Kellerhoff, director for Content and Programs at the Club of Rome and in this episode, we explore Yemi's take on what an AI-positive future could look like in Africa. Yemi paints a particularly optimistic picture of the future of AI in Africa and its possibilities to revolutionise agriculture, healthcare and innovation. In this episode, we'll hear from her based on the experiences in Africa's innovation system, then unpack some of the other views on AI's risks and challenges. Till: Hi, Yemi. Welcome. Pleasure to have you on the Club of Rome Podcast. From where are you calling today? Yemi: Today I'm speaking to you from the rainy season of Lagos. So if you listen behind me, you would hear traffic. Till: We want to talk about this big topic of AI today and a question that gets rarely asked, but is maybe good to be asked from the perspective of the Club of Rome that wants to ask fundamental questions. What do we need AI for? What is AI for from your perspective? Why do we need it? Yemi: I facilitate at a business school and I tell them that it's going to become a utility, like we have electricity, in the long run. We need AI where it helps us solve real consistent problems, issues like healthcare access, agricultural productivity. Can AI help a farmer increase their yields? Can it help a teacher reach 100 students or 400 students instead of maybe 20? So if AI helps us solve all of these kind of problems, then it becomes a transformational, tool or platform or enabler. Till: So Yemi, if we look at concrete examples on the ground where AI is already useful today and will be useful in the future, what would that be from your perspective? Yemi: I mean, there are different variants of things that are happening. Particularly for when we are looking at the impact on climate change in itself on smallholder farmers. In the agri-sector, a lot of projects are using AI to ensure that information gets to the farmers at the, you know, the smallholder farmers because I mean, they grow our crops and we are predominantly an agri-economy. And so, a lot of AI is being utilised and models are being built so that they help the farmers, the smallholder farmers, you know, with predictive crop, the soil testing, everything like that. The other one I know is really healthcare. Diagnosis of diseases, or symptoms as the medical people call it. It's more affordable to people that, in the rural areas, would have to transport themselves to a hospital to be able to get that done. And so if you're looking at the impact on the society, a lot is being done and developed that is supporting and helping the society to grow. Till: And you described AI as a utility, similar to electricity and one can also describe it as a tool. And I think what we see in the development of general, in the last decades and hundreds of years, is that tools can be used both for, let's say, good and evil, right? Tools are...
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    23 min.
  • From the ground up: Lessons in locally-led solutions with Runa Khan

    From the ground up: Lessons in locally-led solutions with Runa Khan
    26 Jun 2026

    What does it take to reach the world's most marginalised communities - not just with aid, but with dignity? In this episode of the Club of Rome Podcast, host Nolita Mvunelo speaks with Runa Khan, member of the Club of Rome and founder of Friendship, an international social purpose organisation that has been working on the river islands and coastal chars of Bangladesh since 2002. In 2025, Friendship won the Earthshot Prize in the Fix Our Climate category.

    Runa grew up in a privileged "glass bubble" in Bangladesh, shielded from the realities of deep poverty. An encounter with communities on the nomadic islands of the Brahmaputra river sparked a lifelong commitment to justice and equity. Her father's words stayed with her: "You are only as rich as what you can do without."

    In this conversation, Runa and Nolita explore what it means to build truly holistic, locally-led solutions. Runa explains the importance of the right interventions at the right time - not standardised programmes designed elsewhere - and why Friendship doesn't just go the last mile, it goes the last metre. They discuss the structural barriers that keep aid from reaching the most vulnerable, the tension between donor-led agendas and community-defined needs, and why quality and beauty matter even – indeed especially - in the most resource-scarce contexts.
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    22 min.
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